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Just Carved My First Braces (Pics)
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Author:  Richard_N [ Fri Dec 22, 2006 7:56 am ]
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Today I carved the braces.( I'm not gonna say voiced !!)

Based everything on the photos in J. Kinkeads book apart from the fact that I feathered the finger braces and tone bars to nothing ( as learnt from here ). It was amazing how the sound changed as material was removed going from dead to resonant and then more different notes. Interesting how some things had more effect than others. I can see why people get so into this - just wish I new what I was doing

Tomorrow I will sand everything smooth and then fit the top to the sides so I'd be interested in your comments please.

Nearly finished top


The boat


The paddle !

Cachalote39073.6734375
Author:  Dave White [ Fri Dec 22, 2006 8:10 am ]
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Richard,

That's looking good. It's a great feeling isn't it.

I don't know much about scalloped braces but to my eye they look fairly meaty still - especially the peaks. I know what it's like on the early guitars and you are always afraid that the tops will explode but I know I overbraced my early builds. It all depends on how the top is sounding. What I do is hold the top by the edge of the upper transverse brace and tap along the length of all of the braces with my ear close to the top. I'm listening not for any specific note but to hear the top ringing and sustaining everywhere with no dead spots.

On the otherhand it will still probably sound better than most (if not all) factory guitars even if it is overbraced to some degree, and it will be fun for you as you get more confidence to see just how well you tune in the balance between tone and stability the more you build.
Author:  Richard_N [ Fri Dec 22, 2006 8:29 am ]
Post subject: 
Thanks Dave.

I stopped there largely because I don't want to go too far but also because at first I saw lots of improvement and change but I'd got to the point that things seemed to be changing less so the fear of messing up outweighs the gains I hear!!!

I was mainly tapping holding the upper transverse at either end and in the middle. I know that they ar a bit more meaty than I've seen hear but before bracing I was realy supprised by how flexible the top was across the grain but since I've zero experience !!!!!!!!!

If I feel lucky tomorrow I could be convinced to narrow the peaks a bit more.Which braces in particular do you think would make the best improvement ?
Author:  Wade Sylvester [ Fri Dec 22, 2006 8:45 am ]
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Richard,
It's looking real good!
Even after many builds, you are never sure if you are doing the right things to make it sound right.
So you are in good company there.
Take lots of notes and just take it slow.
As Dave said they look beefy but it could also be the angle of your picture. I would'nt take them down so much as maybe narrowing the peaks. But Dave and others may know more about this.
Good luck!

Remember, there are no mistakes, only opportunities.

Wade
Author:  Martin Turner [ Fri Dec 22, 2006 8:49 am ]
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[QUOTE=Dave White] Richard,

I don't know much about scalloped braces but to my eye they look fairly meaty still - especially the peaks. [/QUOTE]

Nice work there and yes working braces is fun.

I agree with Dave, I think you can safely take a bit more off the braces and not compromise structural ingerity of your top.

Cheers
Author:  Wade Sylvester [ Fri Dec 22, 2006 8:56 am ]
Post subject: 
Richard,
Hesh has a pic of his top braced on the thred " Christmas
Lutz". It will give you an idea of how some folks are bracing these days.
Nice zoot grab there Hesh!

Wade
Author:  Richard_N [ Fri Dec 22, 2006 9:08 am ]
Post subject: 
Thanks for the comments guys .

I'm open to cautiosly thinning things down a little.

Hesh. The tone bars and finger braces are let into the x braces as per Kinkeads book. where the are let in they are 3mm high (just over 0.1 inch) can I still feather them or will I have to wait for the next build ? By the way love the Tiger Myrtle masterpiece !

Wade - I will definately note the dimensions down tomorrow
Author:  Dave Anderson [ Fri Dec 22, 2006 9:20 am ]
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Good 1st carve! They look good but I would agree with the others that you might want to take a little more off as you see fit.Good luck with it.
Author:  Colin S [ Fri Dec 22, 2006 9:39 am ]
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It's still the favourite part of the build to me, nothing more satisfying than brace carving.

I haven't used scallops for some time now I'm firmly in the 'parabolic' camp, as they suit my playing style. I would agree however with Dave (and the concensus) that you could still reduce the bulk down a bit. Remember that you can lose quite a lot of thickness without losing much strength.

I'd also increase the length of the scallops so that you come to a definite peak rather than a short ridge. If you look at the pictures on page 71 of the Kinkead book you'll see what I mean.

But definitely better than my first effort, I've since had to take the top off of it and put a new one on! Well done.

Colin

Author:  John How [ Fri Dec 22, 2006 3:34 pm ]
Post subject: 
Wade
When your tapping that thing, try holding it on the lower bout where the two tonebars near the edge of the guitar. Maybe a bit closer to the lower x-brace on that side and then try moving around till you get a good strong tone when you thump it with your other hands fingers. I will hold mine there and also up by the transverse. There are a couple nodes where you can get a good strong tap tone. I hear the tone getting more responsive and the actual tone produced, lowering as I carve my braces. You get to a point were it doesn't seem to improve and actually gets to sounding a little floppy but keep in mind that it's just a free plate lying on the table or dangling from your hand. Your still gonna glue it to a rim and put a back on it. Your not even done bracing it yet because you still have to glue on the main brace, the bridge, so it will not be nearly as floppy as you may think.
So you are a little heavy yet but it's something you have to work out yourself. Next time you'll be confident that you can go lighter and probably still more after that.
Ain't it fun
Author:  MSpencer [ Fri Dec 22, 2006 6:03 pm ]
Post subject: 
Great job for your first! I agree with some of the others, looks a little to meaty to me. I am also a recent convert to "parabolic" and have moved away from scalloped braces. Colin was very helpful in giving me some direction on sizing and shaping or at least a starting point to work with. Like some of the other guys, carving braces and doing this phase of a guitar is one of my favority things to do.

Keep up the good work and keep posting your progress

Mike
Author:  Serge Poirier [ Fri Dec 22, 2006 6:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
Very good job Richard, Listen to the good advice on this, less is more in that case, i've experienced it with Hesh' and Colin's help lately and it made such a difference!

Carving the braces is also my favorite part of the build, really relaxing!

Keep up the good work, this soundbox will be closed in no time at all!
Author:  Wade Sylvester [ Sat Dec 23, 2006 2:47 am ]
Post subject: 
John, Thanks for the tap tips!
I had not thought of going a little farther until it starts to get floppy. It makes sence to remember that the bridge is not on yet!
Richard,
Show us progress pics if you can.
I'd love to see what you end up with..

Wade
Author:  Richard_N [ Sat Dec 23, 2006 6:42 am ]
Post subject: 
Thanks everyone. I shaved some more off the braces today and there was a definate improvement. Took notes of all dimensiones and and fitted her to the sides . Currently waiting for the glue to dry .



Thanks again and MERRY CHRISTMAS
Author:  Rod True [ Sun Dec 24, 2006 3:26 am ]
Post subject: 
Richard, that looks good. This is certainly one part of building that will change with each guitar you build.

I look at pictures of my first, second, third and forth and compair that to my 5th and the 5th sure is a lot thinner and liter in the bracing.

what is the thickness of the bracing?

It will still sound like a guitar that's for sure and you won't be disapointed, till that 2nd, 3rd....10th....etc is finished and you'll play the first and say "glad I kept building, this sounds good, but......"

Keep it up, your doing great. Oh and we want to see more pictures of course as you progress.
Author:  Richard_N [ Sun Dec 31, 2006 12:45 am ]
Post subject: 
Rod

The braces are as in Kinkades plans; X braces are 8mm and the tone bars are 7mm (I think !)

The tops now on and its starting to look like a guitar !
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